Smoking Ban

[2-islandangie]

Well how about that!!!! - The government in the UK have voted for a total ban on smoking in all public places.now if they thought it was tough in GC ......It is going to be tough on those that have been smoking for a long time.

[swifty]

hope they can decide what a public place is.
a park?
football ground?
will be interested to see what they say.

[2-islandangie]

I guess they have got a year to make up their minds.
Interesting?

[kc13661]

:thankyou: Personnally I think everyone to their own, I stopped smoking 14 months ago. If someone want s to do it then fine but I think in places like cafe's and resturants whether indoor or terraced people should not smoke when others are eating beside them. More a case of respect for each other than Goverment legislation.

[Ghoulie]

Yet another example of the police / nanny state that Bliar et al would have us live in.

I for one am sick of his 'New Labour' party & all they stand for - cretins - everyone of them. Trouble is - wot do u replace them with - president Ghoulie?

[roxy]

Its a ban in all pubs and clubs not all public places

[fee]

Well in Scotland from next month it's a ban in all enclosed public places - I think more than 50% constitutes enclosed so for example at a train station where there is a brick wall behind you and on each side and a roof but open at the front then my maths tells me this is more than 50% - but to me, I'm "outside". So, are the government going to employ someone to come along with a measuring tape, work out the dynamics and then arrest me for breaking the law - lol :grin:

I do respect other people's right not to be polluted and do avoid smoking near non-smokers and would never dream of smoking where people are eating but if the government were really serious about this, why don't they simply make tobacco illegal? Maybe the £8bn revenue they take every year from us smokers - and before some goody twoshoes comes along to tell me how much we take out of the NHS - it's £1.5bn - so who's paying lip service to the cause ?! Nanny Blair again.

[mary]

Its a ban in all pubs and clubs not all public places

On Sky news this morning, a health minister said it was a complete ban with some exceptions - prisons for the inmates and hospitals - anywhere that is deemed a personal space - long or short term. So you can smoke in your own home but nowhere else. if you are in hospital, there has to be somewhere you can go but the staff arent allowed to smoke.
Hotels have to provide smoking rooms - much llike they do already.

[fee]

Mary, this is probably the script for England. Scotland is different as, probably is, Ireland.

Call me picky but doesn't UK stand for "United" Kingdom - why on earth if a rule has to be imposed, isn't it one rule for all decided jointly by our respective Parliaments and then a message clearly conveyed to Jo Public.:banghead:

[Stephen]

Why UK differs on smoke ban policy




The contrasts could not be starker.

While the cabinet has struggled to agree a deal on banning smoking in workplaces in England, the rest of the UK pushes ahead with complete bans.

Scotland's ban comes into force on 26 March 2006, Northern Ireland's 12 months after that.

Even Wales, which does not have the power to draw up its own law, has indicated it will amend the English one to create a full ban when it is finally passed by parliament.

And the Irish Republic took the plunge back in March 2004.

'Hybrid'

Meanwhile, ministers have got themselves in a muddle over sealed smoking rooms, private members clubs and whether a pub which serves food is different from one that does not.

After weeks of indecision and leaks about new proposals the deal that was finally brokered returned to the commitment made in the Public Health White Paper a year ago to exempt private clubs and "non-food" pubs.

Whatever the reasons for the divergence, it seems certain it is not based on health concerns.



While the smoking industry and smokers' lobby group Forest still cast doubt on the number of deaths caused by passive smoking, the argument has been all but won elsewhere.

The government itself is currently running an advertising campaign warning about the perils of second-hand smoke.

A British Medical Association spokeswoman said: "The battle is over, the government accepts passive smoking kills. The issue has been framed around how to protect workers."

Instead, it seems the ban has been submerged by the political machinations of government as former health secretary John Reid has reportedly dug his heels in for a weaker ban.

Ash's Ian Willmore said the muddle is classic New Labour trying "to find a point somewhere between right and wrong" which will please no-one.

'Balance'

The Department of Health defended the proposals, saying ministers had tried to "strike a balance" between freedom of choice and protecting non-smokers.

But Dr Doug Naysmith, a Labour member of the Health Select Committee, which is investigating the ban proposals, said it goes much further than that.

"I suspect it is coming from Number 10. Tony Blair does not seem 100% happy with a total ban. I think he is anxious about criticisms of the nanny state.


Smoking in public places has already been banned in the Irish Republic

"It is partly to do with the state of the press, which has not been seen in Scotland and elsewhere in the UK."

And Karen Jochelson, a public health expert at the King's Fund health think tank, said England has "lacked a champion" to push the case for a ban.

"In Scotland, the first minister, Jack McConnell, really got on board. We have not seen the same in England."

For others it is much more simple. Maura Gillespie, head of policy at the British Heart Foundation, said: "The cabinet has obviously had a long and tense debate on this issue and it is a shame that some members lacked the courage of their counterparts in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland."

Forest director Simon Clark agrees politics has played a part, but said it should be looked at the opposite way.

"The devolved administrations have very little powers really, I think there was a feeling they had to do something different and this is it."

But Mr Clark also said the nature of the debate has been different.

"In Scotland and Northern Ireland it was very hard for us or anybody to else to put the case against a ban. In England it has been slightly different.

"One of the major differences has been what has been discussed. While in the other parts of the UK it was about health and economics, in England we have also seen the rights of smokers being taken into consideration and I think the debate happening in cabinet reflects this."

Nonetheless, he said he has a sneaking "fear" there could still be another twist which would bring England in line with the rest of the UK and the Irish Republic.

"Tony Blair is standing down and I think he is considering his legacy," he said. "You don't make history by introducing compromises."

[Stephen]

Where will smoking be banned?

Smoking in all public places like pubs, cinemas, offices, factories, public transport and so on will be banned.

Where will you be able to smoke?

People will still be able to smoke outdoors, and in private homes, plus places that Ms Hewitt says are "like homes", such as care institutions, army barracks, and prisons.

When would a ban come into force?

Summer 2007.

[redswanlady]

As a licensee of a "Non" food pub, i feel that the smoking ban is a nail in the coffin for British pubs. Both my husband & I don't smoke but we are very much in the minority. 99% of my customers smoke as do ALL our staff. The decision should have been left up to the individual Licensee to decide what was right for their pub, yet another decision being made by parliment because they think they are doing what is best, but for who??

My customers can also not stand on the street as the local police class this as loitering and move people on, we can't erect an outside canopy for the smokers as we are grade 2 listed so no planning permission would ever be granted. We are in a very no win situation, thank god were leaving soon before the government destroy all the small businesses left.

:veryangry:

[libbyo]

You can smoke in the Palace of Westminster though!!!!!!!!

Libbyo :)

[redswanlady]

And in football grounds!

[Stephen]

the palace of westminster is classed as a roayal palace so therefore its not public , sounds weird but true

as for football grounds more and more are not allowing it , i never smoke at them , when i watched the Bradford fire a while back and that was caused by a cig its not worth

[Stephen]

couldnt you get patio heaters at the abck ??? have you a beer garden ????


if not buy shares in them , you will make akilling

[libbyo]

Westminster need to look at themselves first, and even if they have seperate rules.... should have lead by example and put in their own ban first. But of course " they know best"

Libbyo :)

[redswanlady]

Yes, wev'e got a beer garden, but as most of my customers are 30+ they don't want to be stood outside, and feel they shouldn't have too!!

[Stephen]

its actually the queen not parliament who own Westminister , a hell of a lot of MPs do want it completely banned but its classed as a private dwelling so if that is banned , every housein the country will be banned and no smoking at all

[Stephen]

yep i understand , my sister lives in Sweden and they ahve paatio heaters BUT alot have given up as in winter its -20 and no one wants to leave the pubs to satnd out in the temp just for a fag

[libbyo]

Agree and disagree Steve.

Yup its the Queen, wot owns it, but MP's can have a voluntary ban, like many private households do in the Uk. No problem with that.

Libbyo :)

[redswanlady]

I agree, some pubs do want it banned but it should be left to the individual owner to decide what is right for them. Then the customers can decide to go to the Non smoking pubs or the smoking pubs.

[libbyo]

I agree, some pubs do want it banned but it should be left to the individual owner to decide what is right for them. Then the customers can decide to go to the Non smoking pubs or the smoking pubs.

Yup, Id agree with that.

Libbyo :)

[Stephen]

I agree, some pubs do want it banned but it should be left to the individual owner to decide what is right for them. Then the customers can decide to go to the Non smoking pubs or the smoking pubs.


i totally agree with taht as well, i am in full agreement about food places be it pubs/resataraunst banningit completely as i even thou i am a smoker hate people smoking near me when i am eating :banghead:

[fee]

Well there you go ! A few people from a variety of places and walks of life have a brief and informed discussion on a forum, listening to and taking into account each other's views and opinions and more or less come to agreement on what would work best - for everyone. I think we should form our own opposition party - we could be called the "I'm not just in it for me Party" !
:)

[stu1]

I for one am not a full time smoker though i do partake in the odd cigar or two over the weekend.
To have a complete ban in my view is total madness.
Politics only involved here i guess.Yes thousands of people drain the nhs because they smoke but generally i think it suits the government to a tea..........

All those weekends with far fewer police having to be on the streets as hardly anybody would wanna go out......nhs would be quids in...........but what about the taxes on fags now... how do you think they are going to re cuperate this money..higher taxes and LOTS more of them.i predict crime will rise tenfold and who would care??? in prison you would be able to smoke(bit of a wide light hearted view that bit) but its only been done so this present cretinous government can throw out there statistics at us to think they are doing a good job lol lol lol

Rant and Rage over for a while

[stu1]

and i forgot to add all the pubs that close because of this will make the police happy.........all spin............everyone in our local smokes even the barstaff and so where does that leave it.........

[irisheyes]

Have been reading these threads and remembering various discussions regading these topics before Ireland started the ban. Publicans still say takings are down because of this ban, and outside most pubs there are groups of people, staff included smoking and shivering with the cold!Most days in the papers the councils are giving out about the amount of cigerette butts on the ground. I do agree with not smoking in resturants or pubs that serve food but people should have a say surely.

[Top Cat]

One interesting wording in this new law is 'In an ENCLOSED public place',
could be we should copy the Spanish way and to Un enclose our bars, may-be by fitting large folding doors, as they do in P.R. & when the the weather is ok, 'Hey we have an un-enclosed bar come on over and enjoy a good smoke'.

The Top Cat:nodding:

[fee]

One interesting wording in this new law is 'In an ENCLOSED public place',
could be we should copy the Spanish way and to Un enclose our bars, may-be by fitting large folding doors, as they do in P.R. & when the the weather is ok, 'Hey we have an un-enclosed bar come on over and enjoy a good smoke'.

The Top Cat:nodding:
Well that would certainly rid Scotland of smoking related illness - we'd all die of pneumonia !!!!!!!:D

[Top Cat]

Well there were some cool evenings down by the harbour this year, and I noted a Bar/restaurant under the Porto Nova with its folded doors open which was using patio style gas heaters with were very effective, food for thought.:boozy:

The warm Top Cat

[stevo preston uk]

I think it is the worst thing that the British Goverment has done in the last 9 years. Do they not realise the amount of small buisness that will lose a lot of customers or heaven to bid close in the wake of this smoking ban. I work in a Bingo Hall that is not all that Busy. But all you have to do is look at the customers on a Busy night and and you will see that about 80% of my customers smoke.
Where are all my loyal punters going to go in the interval outside for a fag and all that money will be lost on the Fruit Machines and on Party Bingo
:veryangry: :veryangry: :veryangry:

[Stephen]

just seen this in the mirror and its a very good article

MY FAVOURITE PUB'S GOING UP IN SMOKE
16 February 2006

SO farewell then, English boozer, you warm, fuggy refuge from this plastic world of shallow hype and image obsession.

Soon you'll be gone, replaced with "dining experience outlets" that may be fresher than an Avon Lady's armpit but will be as soulless as a Bracknell roundabout.

If you're an old fella, who's spent his life fighting for his country and seeing his lungs rot in a mine, forget about seeking a haven in your local or working men's club with a pint and a ciggy.

To do so will be a crime. Punishable, ultimately, by jail. Which won't be a bad thing, because at least there you'll be able to enjoy a ciggy in public.

Oh yes, thanks to a breathtaking New Labour U-turn - which saw the Cabinet defy the government's manifesto pledge for a partial ban on smoking, and decided to turn tobacco-users into lepers - convicted criminals will be OK to smoke in public. But not law-abiding, tax-paying smokers. Even if they do it in places where the only people they're affecting are those who don't mind.

How difficult would it be to give every pub and club the right to declare itself smoking or non-smoking, allowing drinkers the choice to avoid or inhale tobacco fumes?





The health lobby says smokers have no rights because passive smoking kills. Even though the only evidence we keep hearing is Roy Castle's death over a decade ago. (Yet we never hear about the millions of passive smokers who haven't died from cigarette smoke in that time.)

Yet smokers DO have a moral right to wallow in their own death fumes, so long as everyone inhaling them consents. Because this government makes tobacco legal and takes billions of pounds off nicotine-users in taxes (not to mention the odd million off Bernie Ecclestone which enabled him to keep tobacco advertising in Formula One). Which buys smokers some respect.

I've never smoked, but I have drunk with smokers all my life. And I want to carry on doing so.

I don't want to be forced to take cans to their houses like druggies organising an illegal rave. I don't want to talk to myself at the bar listening to Coldplay muzak while they're outside freezing their goolies off under patio heaters which burn off the ozone layer.

I don't want to see my favourite boozers stripped of their character and turned into squeaky-clean gastro-bars, with tables full of non-drinkers sipping coffee after their brunchtime special.

I'd rather smell Capstan than garlic. I'd rather risk cancer than die of thirst because all the bar-staff are chasing up lasagne orders in the kitchen.

And what about the other killers in pubs? Radiation from mobile phones. Salmonella from the reheated two-for-a-fiver crap they pass off as dishes of the day. Weil's disease from rat-infected bottle necks. Stray darts, pork scratchings, the suicidal tendencies you develop from looking up and seeing Countdown on the telly.

What about alcohol? You know, the thing that kills livers, car drivers and marriages, which the government has just allowed to be served 24 hours a day if the management fancies it.

So why can't they also allow smoking if management, staff and customers fancy it? Why? Because those old fellas in those pubs and clubs no longer register on the political map. No one turns up to a focus group and rolls their own.

Goodbye The Falstaff Arms. Hello The Avon Lady's Armpit.


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/brianreade/#story1

[swifty]

under the new rules you could be fined £50 if caught smoking in a pub.
if the landlord does not tell you to stop smoking he can be fined £2500.
in my area 1400 people were cautioned for using drugs in 2004.
so you may as well smoke cannabis cos you will just get told off and you can save money.

[Top Cat]

Well, its still to pass in the other House, the Peers are an independant
lot, and just maybe than rotten bill will be chucked out. I'm a non smoker
but I'm sick to death of the Big brother MPs' telling Joe Public what they
can or can not do, because who will this government lean on next?
You can bet your life those ASh people will want to ban smoking in all motor vehicles, more points on your licence with fixed & mobile roadside smoke detectors; in private homes, yes it can be done, all they need are smoke detectors in all rooms including the loo, as airlines do now, such a serious crime could end up with a life sentence in an all smoking jail, thats the result, & they will have to build a lot more just to keep Joe Public happy.

Food for thought

The top Cat:dry:

[Jim Pooley]

Well I'm glad that I can go for a pint soon and not come home stinking of cigarettes.:nodding:

[fee]

At least you guys can still debate over it - it's coming to Scotland in just over a month whether we like it or not now. I can't believe that it's going to be ok to smoke in jails though - how ridiculous is that. It's only a matter of time before some non-smoking con sues the government for an illness he claims to have got through passive smoking in jail ! We certainly live in a ****ed up world !!

[swifty]

Well I'm glad that I can go for a pint soon and not come home stinking of cigarettes.:nodding:
it is coming home with the smell of perfume that causes trouble, the cig smoke hid that.
the divorce rate will go through the roof.

[fee]

it is coming home with the smell of perfume that causes trouble, the cig smoke hid that.
the divorce rate will go through the roof.

don't think that argument would stand up in Court !

[Jim Pooley]

it is coming home with the smell of perfume that causes trouble, the cig smoke hid that.
the divorce rate will go through the roof.

It's a brave man who comes home smelling of booze , perfume and fags, gets into bed drunk, slaps the wife on the backside and says "You're next fatty!"

[fee]

It's a brave man who comes home smelling of booze , perfume and fags, gets into bed drunk, slaps the wife on the backside and says "You're next fatty!"

"Brave" ??!!!!!!! :ohmy: A man with a death wish more like !!!

[swifty]

booze acts like a truth drug at times.

[Top Cat]

The sanctimonious revolsion that has built up against smoking made it inevitable that efforts would be made to prove that smoking is harmful to non-smokers.
The only problem was that one study after another showed that health risks from passive smoking are nonexistent. One study in 1998 concluded
that regular exposure to "environmental smoke" is equivalent to smoking 6 cigarettes a year.
A 7 year study for the World Health Organisation in the same year found the risk of cancer from passive smoking was "statistically insignificant".
The largest study, based on 118,000 Californians between 1960 & 1998 &
published in the British Medical Journal in 2003, comfirmed that smokers had a "higher than average risk of mortality, but found their partners were
unaffected.
The anti-smoking lobby squealed at such unwelcome findings. The most
conspicuous effort to refute them by Professor Nicholas Wald, was found to have been largely based on studies carried out in Japan & China, where
the epidemiology of lung cancer is quite different from that in the West.
Yet last week all this hard evidence was swept aside by the Gadarene rush of the self-righteous.
As for the belief that thew Irish smoking ban has been popular, a detailed
resent study by Insight Research showed that 67% per cent of Irish pubs
have lost trade following the ban, and that for two thirds, the losses have been significent. The only pubs bucking the trend are those which have created outdoor "smoking areas" such as heated patios.
As for the anti-smoking fanatics, and the MP's that voted in favour of the total ban, I'afraid that a sanctimonious glow will have to be its only reward. For in terms of "saving lives", the evidence suggests that they will have achieved nothing at all.

The Top Cat
:angry:

[fee]

I think the government are simply paying lip service to trying create a "healthy" nation.... if so then why not just ban cigarettes, along with alcohol, chocolate, red meat.. etc. etc. It almost makes me want to stamp my feet like a toddler and not even try to stop smoking just as a matter of principle !:angry:

[Top Cat]

Fact is T.B. and his crowd thave created a Nanny State, Big Brother will be watching you. It will all end in tears, for T.B. anyway, "Why wont they vote for me, I was only following the instructions I was ordered to impose by the E.U."

The Top Cat (has got sharp Claws).

:angry:

[K T]

Rab, time for a couple of your smoking smilies. lol.

[oor wullie]

Well Big brother needn't keep a close eye one my father from now on. He is just about the have his leg cut off because of years of smoking.Sanctimonious moi? No just a little sad.

[fee]

Well Big brother needn't keep a close eye one my father from now on. He is just about the have his leg cut off because of years of smoking.Sanctimonious moi? No just a little sad.
oor wullie that's dreadful news, I'm so sorry and all us smokers aren't stupid, we know the risks, but maybe it takes a tragedy like this bring the reality a bit closer to home - I do hope your dad recovers well. x

[oor wullie]

Well thanks for your kind thoughts. I never preach( well i try not to) , i hate it when people do. I'm as guilty as the rest as i've brought back duty free for him, many times but as you say when something like this happens it hits home. He still reckons he could get a game for Sunderland and looking at the league table i think he is right...:thumb:

[Mharie]

In "professional" mode, am doing a whole lot of work prior to smoking bans, but personally think if pubs etc want to allow smoking, then they should be able to. If you log on to The Big Quit and listen to podcast, you'll hear my chat, and then go to givingupsmoking.co.uk, go to ask an expert,you'll see my photie at the top of the page. It shouldn't be too hard to work out which one is me!

[Stephen]

LONDON (Reuters) - Pub chain JD Wetherspoon posted a 21 percent rise in first-half profit but was cautious about prospects for the second half of the year due to the impact of impending smoking bans and the World Cup.

The company, which runs around 650 managed pubs, said it had also shelved plans to ban smoking in all its pubs in the next three months after profits fell sharply in already smoke-free pubs.

Profit rose 27.4 million pounds for the six months to January 22 on turnover up 1 percent to 406.3 million pounds.

Belt-tightening measures such as cheaper glasses and wage-control were the main reasons for the improvement.

"We've been quite active on costs generally across the board," Finance Director Jim Clarke told Reuters.

Wetherspoon said overall like-for-like sales increased 1.9 percent in February, but it was cautious going into the second half, which will include the World Cup in June and July.

Most Wetherspoon pubs do not show sports or play music.

Wetherspoon shares, which have risen steadily over the last year, were down 2.8 percent at 347-1/4 pence by 10:37 a.m., valuing the company at around 574.5 million pounds.

SCOTTISH DRAG

Like-for-like sales at its pubs where smoking is already banned fell 7.6 percent, and margins fell around 20 percent, as increased food sales failed to compensate for a decline in bar and slot-machine sales.

Wetherspoon had planned to convert all its pubs to non-smoking by May but said it would now wait until the last possible moment when a blanket ban is introduced across England in the middle of next year

We had hoped that people who didn't like smoking would come flocking to our pubs, but they've flocked elsewhere it seems," chairman Tim Martin told the Daily Telegraph newspaper.

Wetherspoon currently has 49 non-smoking pubs, which is set to increase to 88 or 13 percent of its estate when smoking is outlawed in Scotland on March 26.

"With Scotland going non-smoking, it's the first time for us a whole country has done that, so we don't know for sure what's going to happen with that. It could have an impact; it's likely to," said Clarke.

Analysts say Wetherspoon is more vulnerable to sales declines than other chains because its mostly high street pubs do not have large gardens and outdoor areas.

"The bad news is that the profit deterioration in its non-smoking pubs is severe," said analysts at Bridgewell.

"Our chief concern remains the smoking ban," said Altium Securities analyst Greg Feehely, retaining his "sell" recommendation on the company's shares.

"Trials of non-smoking pubs have seen like-for-like sales decline, which in itself is very significant ... coupled with the fact that the operating profit margin in these pubs also fell by 4 percentage points (or by a quite staggering 20 percent on our estimates)," he added.

"If things weren't bad enough already, the World Cup is likely to add to the trading woes. Plasma screens are being rolled out across the estate, but this process will not be complete ahead of June. A further deterioration in like-for-like sales should therefore be anticipated," said Feehely.

Analysts at Dresdner Kleinwort Wasserstein downgraded the stock from "buy" to "hold", setting the new target price at 360 pence.

The firm raised its first-half dividend 10 percent to 1.6 pence per share.

[Top Cat]

Is a vehicle an office? (i.e. a place of work). Yes, if it used for work. However it is far more complicated that that. A delivery van will also be covered by the ban if the driver does not own it, but not if he does.
Also, if the van has more than one driver it will be covered even if one of the drivers' is the owner.
This will not apply to taxis.
Even after the Bill becomes law, some of its trickiest measures will have to be set out in further regulations, including what is meant by a substantially enclosed public place, and what is a workplace.

Top Cat

[ubhisteach]

I think it is the worst thing that the British Goverment has done in the last 9 years. Do they not realise the amount of small buisness that will lose a lot of customers or heaven to bid close in the wake of this smoking ban. I work in a Bingo Hall that is not all that Busy. But all you have to do is look at the customers on a Busy night and and you will see that about 80% of my customers smoke.
Where are all my loyal punters going to go in the interval outside for a fag and all that money will be lost on the Fruit Machines and on Party Bingo
:veryangry: :veryangry:


i personally think that the smoking ban in scotland is the best thing to ever happen! us non smokers do not want to have to put up with second hand smoke. if you want to kill yourselves by smoking then go ahead but why should innocent non smokers have to experience it aswell. we dont want to increase our risk of lung cancer just because of a smokers selfishness! :angry::veryangry:

[Top Cat]

i personally think that the smoking ban in scotland is the best thing to ever happen! us non smokers do not want to have to put up with second hand smoke. if you want to kill yourselves by smoking then go ahead but why should innocent non smokers have to experience it aswell. we dont want to increase our risk of lung cancer just because of a smokers selfishness! :angry::veryangry:

I was reading in the Mail last week that they now think inhaling leaf smoke is good for you!

As it has been said before in this thread, non-smokers do not have to enter a smoking environment, so innocent non-smokers do not have
to increase their risk of L. C.
Unfortunately Smokers will no longer have that choice. "This is your Nanny State calling".

The non-smoking Top Cat

:wacko:

[ubhisteach]

I was reading in the Mail last week that they now think inhaling leaf smoke is good for you!

As it has been said before in this thread, non-smokers do not have to enter a smoking environment, so innocent non-smokers do not have
to increase their risk of L. C.
Unfortunately Smokers will no longer have that choice. "This is your Nanny State calling".

The non-smoking Top Cat

:wacko:

well it is quite hard to avoid going into a smoking enviroment because smokers will smoke where ever they like! we cannot help but be annoyed by smokers! do you think non-smokers would deliberalty go into a smoking enviorment? thats the stupidest thing i have ever heard!:veryangry:

[fee]

well it is quite hard to avoid going into a smoking enviroment because smokers will smoke where ever they like! we cannot help but be annoyed by smokers! do you think non-smokers would deliberalty go into a smoking enviorment? thats the stupidest thing i have ever heard!:veryangry:

Not really that hard to avoid - where I live we've got a J D Wetherspoon directly opposite a Chicago Rock. Wetherspoons non-smoking, the Rock - smoking. It would be a very deliberate choice if you opted for the venue which didn't suit your personal preference, which is why this ban is crazy - give licensees the option to decide and then the punters can make an informed choice on where they want to go - not exactly rocket science !:banghead:

[Stephen]

hasnt you in Scotland go no choice as from Sunday , ?????? we have another 15 months before the ban come in , BUT if i go into a non smoking restaraunt/pub I WILL NOT smoke if i want to smoke in the pub i will go into a pub that allows it same applies to non smokers they have a choice if they walk into a pub and its smoky go elsewhere if it effects you and winds you up that much

[ubhisteach]

Not really that hard to avoid - where I live we've got a J D Wetherspoon directly opposite a Chicago Rock. Wetherspoons non-smoking, the Rock - smoking. It would be a very deliberate choice if you opted for the venue which didn't suit your personal preference, which is why this ban is crazy - give licensees the option to decide and then the punters can make an informed choice on where they want to go - not exactly rocket science !:banghead:

well most places where i live do allow smoking! so i cant really help it can i? until sunday then all the smokers will not be able to!!!!:nodding: . :p

[fee]

I'm sure there must be something in the Human Rights Constitution which is being infringed here - making it illegal to carry out a legal practice?!:confused:

[Top Cat]

Not really that hard to avoid - where I live we've got a J D Wetherspoon directly opposite a Chicago Rock. Wetherspoons non-smoking, the Rock - smoking. It would be a very deliberate choice if you opted for the venue which didn't suit your personal preference, which is why this ban is crazy - give licensees the option to decide and then the punters can make an informed choice on where they want to go - not exactly rocket science !:banghead:

Well said fee, freedom, & choice are what we should have. Many more of our pubs will close because of this, resulting in more people being put out of work. Lets hope the people will vote them out A.S.A.P.

:angry:

[ubhisteach]

Well said fee, freedom, & choice are what we should have. Many more of our pubs will close because of this, resulting in more people being put out of work. Lets hope the people will vote them out A.S.A.P.

:angry:

i seriously think that poeple who smoke cannot read! you are arguing about something that is killing you? it even says it in big bold letters on the packs! if ur so desperate to kill urself by smoking why not keep it to ur homes then us smart non smokers will not have to put up with ur constant second hand smoke!:angry:

[fee]

i seriously think that poeple who smoke cannot read! you are arguing about something that is killing you? it even says it in big bold letters on the packs! if ur so desperate to kill urself by smoking why not keep it to ur homes then us smart non smokers will not have to put up with ur constant second hand smoke!:angry:

Quite right and while we're at it we'll only run our car engines in our garages and keep our carbon monoxide to ourselves and I hope you're swimming to GC for your next holiday because have you any idea how much pollution aviation fuel causes - get of your soapbox and live and let live mate ! We're not all stupid, we know the risks and choose to take them just like you make choices in your life which other people might not - e.g. drive a car, eat meat etc. etc. - this was a democracy last time I looked.:glare:

[Top Cat]

Quite right and while we're at it we'll only run our car engines in our garages and keep our carbon monoxide to ourselves and I hope you're swimming to GC for your next holiday because have you any idea how much pollution aviation fuel causes - get of your soapbox and live and let live mate ! We're not all stupid, we know the risks and choose to take them just like you make choices in your life which other people might not - e.g. drive a car, eat meat etc. etc. - this was a democracy last time I looked.:glare:

I'am not certain that we do live in a democracy, for according to the Daily Telegraph the smoking ban is to include all those travelling to work in company vehicles.

:angry:

[fee]

I'am not certain that we do live in a democracy, for according to the Daily Telegraph the smoking ban is to include all those travelling to work in company vehicles.

:angry:
That's because it's considered their workplace - must say I hate smoking in vehicles - it's too small a space whereas a pub, for example, would be a good place ........ hahahahha :)

[Top Cat]

That's because it's considered their workplace - must say I hate smoking in vehicles - it's too small a space whereas a pub, for example, would be a good place ........ hahahahha :)

But, if you go to work in your own vehicle you are exempt! some law.

:dry:

[fee]

Like I said somewhere earlier, it's now illegal to carry out a legal practice ! Why don't mr B and his nannies just make it a class c drug and stop getting all that revenue from it instead of paying lip service in the hope of gaining votes - the game's up tony, we're not all idiots !!!!!!!

[Top Cat]

i seriously think that poeple who smoke cannot read! you are arguing about something that is killing you? it even says it in big bold letters on the packs! if ur so desperate to kill urself by smoking why not keep it to ur homes then us smart non smokers will not have to put up with ur constant second hand smoke!:angry:

Make smokers smoke at home? Not if the banning brigade have their way, they have already said that non smokers in the home will suffer .
Secondly, second-hand smoke might not be pleasent, but there is still no proof that second-hand smoke kills, any more than any other smoke.

:sleep:

[sonofsos]

Like I said somewhere earlier, it's now illegal to carry out a legal practice ! Why don't mr B and his nannies just make it a class c drug and stop getting all that revenue from it instead of paying lip service in the hope of gaining votes - the game's up tony, we're not all idiots !!!!!!!

How is it illegal to carry out a legal practice ? When the laws come in then it will be an illegal practice the same as using your mobile while driving, drinking alcohol in the steet etc.

[ubhisteach]

Make smokers smoke at home? Not if the banning brigade have their way, they have already said that non smokers in the home will suffer .
Secondly, second-hand smoke might not be pleasent, but there is still no proof that second-hand smoke kills, any more than any other smoke.

:sleep:

well the smoker in the home could be considerate to the non smoker and smoke outside! fair enough there may not be any proof but it still doesnt mean that it is not a serious matter according to a non smokers health! especially for a person like me who has really bad side effects of second hand smoke! :angry:

[Top Cat]

The Tobacco-Loving French will be allowed to carry on puffing their Gitanes and Gauloises in smoky bars and bistros after the French government caved in on plans to ban smoking in public places.
Existing laws require cafes and restaurants to establish clearly separated smoking and non-smoking areas. Fed up with these rules being widely ignored, opponents had pinned their hopes on an outright ban.
President Jacques Chirac's centre-right government had vowed to push such a degree through parliament, but Xavier Bertrand, the health minister, backed away from this last week. Instead of pursuing a ban, he announced a "Vast consultation" on the issue, to be held over several months.
The Green Party accused the president & government of "sacrificing general interest for the wishes of lobby groups", adding: "The government's political line can be summed up in one word: cowardice"
"Once again , the tobacco lobby has won".
France's long love affair with tabacco began in the 16th century, when Jean Nicot-the Frenchman after whom nicotine was named, became the first European to cultivate the plant. Thirty percent of French adults smoke at present.
A photograph in the Liberation newspaper added insult to injury for anti-smoking campaigners. Taken in the corridors of the Assemblee Nationale, it showed a suited man puffing away directly in front of a no smoking sign.
Is it possible that the British government could learn something from the French after all?

[rach]

can u smoke in bars and clubs etc in puerto rico or is there a smoking ban in place there? or is it just places that serve food or what?
:confused:

[fee]

Rach, see the post I just put on under the "Bars Restaurants and Nightlife" section which should help I hope.